The Disneyland Audition: Max Diaz and Joel Meza on Saying Yes (Episode 189)

Everything you do is an audition.

Sometimes the audition doesn't look like an audition at all. In Episode 189 of The Career Musician, Nomad launches a new format he had wanted to try forever: Talk 'n Tunes, a jam session in the round with conversation in between. His guests are two working pros, bassist Max Diaz and drummer Joel Meza, recorded at PA Rehearsal Studios.

The headline story, from the show notes, is Max's "audition" that turned out to be a full day at Disneyland, where the artist was really testing chemistry. It is the perfect picture of a lesson the whole hour keeps circling: artists hire for the hours you are not playing. Here are the biggest music career lessons from the conversation.

Say yes, show up, and play the song you know

Joel's own first gig with Nomad is a case study. Nomad was auditioning players for an artist at PA, posted about it, and figured Joel would be busy. Joel saw it the night before and came anyway. He walked into a hallway full of players he recognized from great bands, then learned from the guy next to him that there was a song list. He had not seen it. He listened to one song in the hall, walked in and played it.

His attitude explains why he got the call: if Nomad calls him to do something, he will do whatever he can to make it happen. As the show notes put it, say yes before your brain talks you out of it. Luck = preparation + opportunity, and you can't be lucky if you don't show up.

Ignorant courage versus imposter syndrome

Nomad asks a question that haunted him from his early 20s to around 40: am I good enough for that gig? One guest describes an early phase of pure "ignorance," taking gigs he was not prepared for and getting much better because of it. Now that he is far better, imposter syndrome kicks in, partly because he knows so many great players.

The table walks through the four stages of learning: you don't know what you don't know, then you become aware of what you don't know, then you can do it with conscious effort, and finally it is automatic, the way you speak without sounding out each letter. Muscle memory. Flow state.

"That early stage of having no fear definitely works to your advantage."

The table, 4:58

Ear first, theory second

A big theme is how musicians really learn. Max learned Latin styles in music school and compares it to players who grow up in church: you are around monsters every week and absorb it by osmosis. YouTube University lets you follow your interests the same way. The table brings up Victor Wooten's point that babies learn to talk by speaking, not by studying prepositions.

Follow the "wait, what was that?" moment. Theory was written down to reproduce what people already liked, like writing down a recipe after a great meal. One guest shares a friend's advice: look for things that are sticky. If something stops you for a second, lean into it. There is probably a reason your brain brought it up. That is your voice.

Then they prove it. A guest plays a chord movement of major chords, F to A flat to D flat to G flat and back, that he traces to the Dave Brubeck and Paul Desmond era. Nomad analyzes it harmonically, finds a common tone, starts soloing, and then tells himself to stop thinking and just go. All of that happens in milliseconds.

Subsidize your talent, without shame

When Nomad asks how you turn talent, skill and relationships into a check in the bank, the answer is the same steps: follow your spark, present yourself, show up, make friends, and say yes. Always say yes.

Max unpacks an idea the table calls subsidizing your talent. If all your income comes from your instrument, you will be hungrier, chase every call and build a wider skill set (he plays upright and key bass, so if you need bass, it is done). But it can be stressful. If you want to write or produce, there is no shame in an internship or another job to support it. When the pandemic pulled the rug out, he realized it was not his fault. He had shown up and said yes.

"Don't take it as a failure on your part if you have to supplement your income with something else... I would even argue it makes you more of a musician."

Max Diaz, 28:06

Nomad puts it bluntly: creativity and chaos can't live together. If you are $1,300 short on a $2,600 LA one-bedroom, you are not producing a song tonight. The table connects it to Maslow's hierarchy of needs: you can't reach the creative level when the basics are missing. His line: don't fake it till you make it, work it until you make it. That is The Biz pillar: diversify or die.

Acknowledge the altitude

Max just came off a tour with 24 scheduled shows in a month, six show days and a drive day each week, shared hotel rooms, the works. The high points were fans singing the songs back in places where he doesn't speak the language. In Brussels, standing in an old city square before a show, it hit him. He grew up in Englewood, picked up the bass at 15, promised himself he would get here someday, and there he was. He let himself cry.

His advice: when a moment calls for you to be present, face it consciously. Don't get a big head. They asked you to come play bass. But have the right amount of "altitude."

Nomad relates. He wanted to be a session cat, and in Nashville he finally did three sessions in one day, at 10, 2 and 6, on three albums. After moving to LA, within a month he was at John Powell's studio playing guitar on the score for Mr. & Mrs. Smith. Most of the time, he admits, he never stopped to let those moments soak in, because he was always looking up.

"You're in a plane. Ten minutes ago you were on the ground. Now you're 35,000 feet up. Look down and be like, we did it."

Nomad, 37:49

And the person in front of you tonight spent money to come see you. Do the thing. Be here right now. That is Humility and Energy from the ETHOS code in the same breath.

The takeaway

Gigs are won offstage as much as on it. Say yes, show up ready, follow what is sticky, support your art however you need to, and stop to acknowledge how far you have come. When the next call comes, prepare with the free Audition Secrets guide, and if you are in LA, the episode recommends PA Rehearsal Studios (code NOMAD).

Get the gig. Keep the gig. Build the career.

Watch on YouTube or find every episode on the TCM Podcast page.