Leslie Odom Jr. on Building a Music Career That Lasts (Episode 150)

You learned how to make music. Nobody taught you how to make a living making music.

For the 150th episode of The Career Musician, Nomad welcomes a friend and collaborator: Leslie Odom Jr., the singer, songwriter, actor and author best known as Aaron Burr in Hamilton, a role that earned him a Tony and a Grammy. Nomad has worked with Leslie as a guitarist and producer, and the conversation feels like two old friends talking shop.

It is an episode about building a music career for the long haul. Leslie shares the advice that kept him from quitting, how his community funded his first record, and why love, not hustle, is what gets you through. Here are the lessons.

Music came first, but think of yourself as a storyteller

Music came first for Leslie: singing in church and at home with parents who loved music. But what made sense of his many interests was a bigger label. Singing, acting, dancing, speaking and writing all fall under storytelling.

He has rarely met a gifted person who was narrow. Talented people usually know a lot about other things too, and that brings richness to their work. Nomad agrees. It is why he goes by Nomad: as creative beings, we are all a little Renaissance-minded. That is The Biz pillar in action, diversify or die.

There was some design in how Leslie branched out. He figured Hamilton would bring acting opportunities on its own, so he put his energy into the records, because those would not happen by themselves.

"What did you do in the absence of a ringing phone?"

Here is the story every working musician should hear. Leslie came to LA to act, hit a rough patch around 30, and was ready to quit. He met with a mentor, who heard him out and said he could quit, but he would love to see Leslie try first. Leslie thought he had been trying for over a decade. The mentor saw it differently: Leslie was sitting at home waiting for the phone to ring.

"The phone didn't ring today, so what did you do for yourself in the absence of a ringing phone? Did you call anybody? Did you read anything? Did you write anything?"

Leslie Odom Jr., 8:27

Then the line that changed his life: you're a singer, and you're not singing at all. Do you know how many coffee shops would love to have you? Leslie's whole singing career grew from that. Today he plays beautiful performing arts centers around the country, and he reminds himself it started as a dream to play coffee shops at lunch hour.

The mentor could see Leslie was a lifer. He was not asking how to get famous or get a better car. He wanted to pay his rent doing what he loved. Work begets work, and it often starts with the humblest step.

Your community is your first record deal

Leslie's first album was a Kickstarter record, and it scared him. Who was he to ask for money when there were better singers out there? He pictured begging strangers. Then he looked at the donor list: middle school teachers, his parents' friends, cousins, college buddies, people from LA, giving $15, $25 or $50.

"My community really gave me my first record deal, because that was the record that I took into the label and was like, this is the kind of music I want to make."

Leslie Odom Jr., 14:49

And the self-doubt? The only way through it, he says, is a little bit of courage. We like to think we are brave, but you don't know until you test it. Every chance is a chance to prove something to yourself about yourself.

Reach out. The worst they can say is no.

How did Leslie and Nomad meet? Leslie was chasing a guitar sound his team kept saying didn't exist. He went on YouTube and thought about Babyface: whoever plays guitar for Babyface might lead him to the player he needed. That led him to Nomad, and he sent a DM out of the blue.

His logic is pure TCM. You might not get the guy, but the guy may know a guy, or point you to someone he trained. Nomad's point for you: if something in your spirit says reach out, do it. The worst that happens is no response or a no. Luck = preparation + opportunity, but sometimes you have to create the opportunity.

Protect the sacred space

On success, Leslie is thoughtful. For him the work is a spiritual journey and his craft is sacred space, reserved for the best of him: his most generous, his kindest. That means he can't pollute it by being petty or egotistical. If a crew member feels disrespected, it is his job to address it.

When the big calls come, he usually thinks they have the wrong guy. Most of the parts he really goes after, he doesn't get. But when Regina King asked him to play Sam Cooke in One Night in Miami, he decided that if she believed in him, he had to find a way to believe in himself. He left that set a better artist and a better singer. That is Humility from the ETHOS code, and it is also low maintenance / no drama: the best of you, every day on set.

Success looks like freedom, and life runs in seasons

Leslie defines success as freedom: time with family when they need you, a low-paying job you believe in, or a job you take just because it sounds fun. And a mentor taught him that the first responsibility of freedom is making sure somebody else is free, the people who ride with you included.

His life is a struggle for balance. You need to grind, and sometimes you need to be still. You can't muscle inspiration. He also believes in seasons. After 500 Hamilton shows and a thousand concerts since, he doesn't do the same warm-up every night. Some nights he needs to joke with the band or connect with his family. Some seasons he is up at 5 a.m. writing and working out. Others are for sleeping in and making breakfast. Know which season you are in.

Love is a verb

Asked to sum up his advice for struggling musicians, actors and writers, Leslie, author of Failing Up, keeps it simple: love it. And love is a verb. Tend to it, encourage the light in other people, read about it, write about it, spend your time with it.

"I think if you love something hard enough, eventually it'll love you back. Not always in the way that you expect it to, but in the way you need it to."

Leslie Odom Jr., 36:23

Grinding for the sake of grinding, he says, will wear you right down. What sustains you is passion, a genuine relationship with your craft, and a community of artists. He hopes his albums leave breadcrumbs for his kids about who their dad was.

The takeaway

Don't wait for the phone. Play the coffee shop, let your community in, reach out to the people you want to work with, and protect the space where you do your best work. Then love it hard enough that it loves you back. For your next move, grab the free Get the Gig guide, and find Leslie's music at leslieodomjr.com.

Get the gig. Keep the gig. Build the career.

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